The Dr Jo Show

00:00:00:00 - 00:00:11:02
Unknown
Last night SBS inside the long awaited program My Body, My choice, featuring yours truly. Was it a stitch up or was it a fair representation of what went down? And that's today on the Doctor Jo Show.

00:00:12:17 - 00:00:26:03
Unknown
when I. SBS insight reached out last November to let me know that they were thinking about doing a program as they season premiere called My Body My Choice, and that they were wanting to have me as a guest. I was suspicious, I'm going to be honest with you guys. There is a

00:00:26:03 - 00:00:44:18
Unknown
There's a real hesitancy in me when dealing with the mainstream media. On the issue of abortion, because time and time again, they have blatantly lied on the issue. And when they've represented, the issue at all, because most of the time they don't even touch it. They usually stack up a line of pro-abortion voices, and they don't even include any of the data or the facts.

00:00:44:18 - 00:01:04:13
Unknown
I've talked to you guys about that. On the Babies Born Alive issue. At the moment, the West Australian press is focusing a little bit on that issue, but the only voice they quote is that of the Health minister and Bridget Sanderson. To say that babies born alive don't exist, that this is shocking misinformation. They quote abortionists like Doctor Alison Kray when they speak about it, they don't actually ask anybody else.

00:01:04:18 - 00:01:15:16
Unknown
And so that's a real problem I've experienced at first hand. Yesterday when I was in WA, the West Australian had an article about the fact that, you know, we had protesters outside the office of Babajide Sanderson. But

00:01:15:16 - 00:01:30:23
Unknown
in the article itself, the journalist doesn't even bother to ring me. She had my number, but they didn't contact me to ask me why I was there and what we were fighting for. They didn't include the daughter of the 31 babies who survived their abortions. What they did is pretend that this was just religious conservatives.

00:01:30:23 - 00:01:59:09
Unknown
So they they say religious conservatives have used extremely rare cases of non-viable fetuses, initially surviving late term abortion to call for legal protection. So using the words religious conservatives unviable fetuses, there's no data or evidence to back up any of those. I have never once portrayed this as a religious issue. And the only, perspective they quote is Peter Abetz from the Australian Christian lobby, who happened to be attending, this protest, but he didn't organize it.

00:01:59:14 - 00:02:10:12
Unknown
But they want to make it seem like it's only Christians that care about this issue, only really far right extremists. They don't want to speak to me. So they didn't quite make it, even though I was the one that organized the event.

00:02:10:12 - 00:02:35:16
Unknown
I've been shot many times before this. In 2019, when I wrote a Sydney Morning Herald opinion piece, and in it I make the claim that late term abortions increased by 44% after Victoria legalized abortion up to before the ABC did a so-called fact check on that and gave it the ranking of completely untrue, even though on the raw data using the method of average increase, late term abortions had increased by 44% in Victoria since then, legalized abortion after birth

00:02:35:16 - 00:02:39:15
Unknown
and the and the fact check itself finished with the views of abortion providers

00:02:39:21 - 00:02:59:08
Unknown
explaining why they needed more abortion and more funding. It was a complete joke of a fact check. And yet what they do, they do this deliberately because they're just trying to sort of make you seem really and credible and just like you're making stuff up. This happened in the live birth spiel. We organized a protest where over 5000 people attended.

00:02:59:14 - 00:03:20:11
Unknown
The Advertiser published an article saying there was 120 people there. I mean, you can't make this stuff up. It's such a joke. Look at another one of their headlines. Around the like, bad spill. They said, the Catholic Archdiocese voices support for abortion law reforms that force women to give birth after 28 weeks. This was the headline in the Advertiser.

00:03:20:17 - 00:03:37:24
Unknown
They didn't mention the fact that women are forced to give birth after 28 weeks in a late term abortion. What they wanted to do is add to this lie that was being told that the bill that I'd introduced was I was a forced bed pill when it wasn't. You have to have a birth anyway. And yet this is just how they do it.

00:03:37:24 - 00:03:58:03
Unknown
They lie and lie and lie and, you the only reason I've been able to get any modicum of success is because on social media, I've been able to get the word out and to my email database as well, which continues to increase. I've been able to get out the facts and the data, and that's the only way, because the mainstream media just repeatedly and consistently lies.

00:03:58:09 - 00:04:21:16
Unknown
So when SBS insight contacted me, I felt some reluctance. I also knew it was an opportunity, because even to have this discussion on the mainstream media is is a big thing. They don't ever tackle this. They don't give me a voice or people from my perspective, a voice. If they, if they cover it at all. It's in that language that I just talked about.

00:04:21:16 - 00:04:39:19
Unknown
It's just a religious campaign. It's Christians, forcing their beliefs on everybody else. So, you know, there was a part of me that thought, okay, this is an opportunity. But I did quite assertively tell the producer on the phone that I was concerned it was a stitch up, and I was given many assurances that it wouldn't be. But let's talk now about what actually happened on the show.

00:04:39:19 - 00:04:53:14
Unknown
So the way it works is you film for two hours, and then they cut it to 55 minutes. And one of the problems with that guys is it's not live. And so when they cut and edit things, they can cut and edit things to craft a particular narrative.

00:04:53:14 - 00:05:06:23
Unknown
and as I watched the show unfold last night, I could see that there was a narrative that they were trying to craft, and there were particular voices that were elevated in the in the studio itself. It it was like walking into the lion's den.

00:05:06:23 - 00:05:39:03
Unknown
I was clearly surrounded and it was myself and Matt Cliff, who's the director of Cherish Life in Queensland, a wonderful pro-life organization. And then largely, the audience was stacked with pro-abortion, pro government assisted suicide advocates, GP's that gave abortion. So abortionists, we were surrounded by all of these people and during the two hours when we filmed, it didn't feel as bad as all that because creamy did ask me a lot of questions, and she gave me a lot of time in the pre-record to answer those questions.

00:05:39:05 - 00:06:07:07
Unknown
And what I then noticed, though, when I watched the show back last night, is what they did do was steal all of my answers from their persuasive power or any of the data or evidence that I gave. They just didn't allow that to be aired on on the TV screen. So what you guys saw was a heavily edited cut where they allowed me to say something normative, like, I don't think we should, kill human beings and abortion is wrong.

00:06:07:13 - 00:06:36:21
Unknown
But then they didn't allow me to go into any granular detail. The one place where they did which was good was I was able to talk about the late term abortion procedure of what a third term, abortion looks like. And I do hope that that opened the eyes of people. I also hope that it had some good, the fact that I was, you know, a young woman advocating for the rights of these children in utero from the perspective of human rights, I think that's a voice and a perspective that would have shocked a lot of people who have been brainwashed into being pro-choice.

00:06:36:23 - 00:06:45:18
Unknown
So I think those are good things. But let's take a look at the clips that they did, er, of what some of the pro-abortion advocates said.

00:06:45:18 - 00:06:51:18
Unknown
And then I'll tell you the responses I actually gave, but that they censored when they ad the TV program last night.

00:06:51:24 - 00:07:23:01
Unknown
You had an abortion last year. Did you feel like you had to justify your choice? I didn't feel like I had to justify my choice because I operate in the circles that it sounds like you used to. Joanna, I'm very left wing, progressive feminist, and all of my friends and family were incredibly supportive of me. But that doesn't mean I didn't come up against people who would disagree privately or publicly with me, or that there was a level of subconscious or conscious sort of tension or questions that I felt my parents and grandparents wanted to ask me, but maybe were too nervous to.

00:07:23:03 - 00:07:41:20
Unknown
What questions do you think they were wanting to ask you? I think that when someone falls pregnant and they didn't plan on or didn't want to, there's often questions about the circumstances in which it happened, whether you were using contraception, whether it was because of circumstances like. Right. It's a really a responsibility or like a sort of a shaming position.

00:07:41:20 - 00:08:09:15
Unknown
I think that there is often this silence around whether you were reckless, whether you were irresponsible, and whether your choice was made in fair circumstance. And I think that those are fair questions. But I also think it's important to note that the circumstances in which I made my decision were because I take a medication for cystic acne called at, that causes a high level of high risk of birth defects in fetuses, in babies, and essentially, I think that my decision would have been the same either way.

00:08:09:15 - 00:08:20:14
Unknown
But I realize having made that decision and making that decision publicly with the platform that I do in my personal life, that it made it easier and more palatable for people, for me to have made that decision as well.

00:08:20:21 - 00:08:42:15
Unknown
what really struck me in that room was how stories are so powerful in helping move people's emotions. So hearing Hannah tell a story of, wanting to get an abortion because contraception failed and she was unexpectedly pregnant, and then having to tell her mom and her grandparents and having to be subjected to questions and their responses to it.

00:08:42:17 - 00:09:05:07
Unknown
You know, equally in that room, there was the guy who spoke about being circumcised as a child and the trauma of that. There was another woman. He spoke about the effects of, mandatory vaccinations in her employment. And I was really struck by the fact that in the context of abortion, I was there to speak up for these babies, but I couldn't tell their stories because we literally don't know their stories.

00:09:05:07 - 00:09:29:08
Unknown
We don't know how they feel. We don't know what aspirations they have for their life. We have no idea what they could have been and who they even are. And it is my job. In your job, to speak, to be a voice for the voiceless. But what's really hot is we're at this tremendous disadvantage, even from the get go, because Hannah can pull on the heartstrings about this shame in position and about her mum's response.

00:09:29:14 - 00:09:50:05
Unknown
And, and and we we just don't have recourse to that because the biggest genocide, is killing these little babies who just have no voice. So that's my first point. The second point I want to make is when she talks about this shame imposition. It just it's it's really uncomfortable with me because it just it rings a B.S..

00:09:50:05 - 00:10:08:10
Unknown
I, I had to put up this video on her, on her socials and on Instagram. I stayed inside of her abortion story and comment after comment after comment is about how amazing she is. Thank you for being a warrior. You need to be our next female Prime Minister. You spoke for me tonight. You're, You're my hero, Hannah.

00:10:08:10 - 00:10:34:22
Unknown
I literally screamed at the TV and excitement in my bedroom and parents got shocked. You know, just coming out to comment about hero worship and adulation and and yet, I insight and Hannah's Instagram videos didn't even have me, speaking. They just had my face. And people recognize me. And and in contrast, there were just so many negative comments, from people talking about, you know, what would Joanna know?

00:10:34:24 - 00:10:57:15
Unknown
She really needs to stop speaking Joanna's faces. Did you see them? How disgusting. Joanna is not a medical doctor. Why are we letting this woman speak? I'm outraged. And it's like, well, Hannah talks the left, loves to play victim and speak a big game about this. The way we're all making them feel so much shame when in actual fact, I'm the one who.

00:10:57:15 - 00:11:20:14
Unknown
And we are the ones who are who. I totally bullied, harassed, intimidated, and made to feel shame because we've dared articulate an opinion that it's wrong to kill a human being in utero. That Hannah's the establishment. You know, that the radical left tries to to pretend that they're anti-establishment when they are literally the definition of the establishment in this program.

00:11:20:14 - 00:11:39:22
Unknown
If you look at the, the way Hannah is allowed to articulate her points and the airtime that she's given, and we're going to talk about the fact that my responses were censored in a minute. She is literally the establishment and and, you know, it's just it feels fake to me when she talks about a shaming position.

00:11:39:24 - 00:12:04:11
Unknown
If she is feeling ashamed, it's not because other people are making her feel ashamed because everybody is applauding her choice to kill her baby. If she's feeling ashamed, that's that's got to be coming from inside a conscience because she she knows she's killed a child. It's not coming from anybody else. She talks about her mum being emotional when told that Hannah's about to kill her grandchild, as if her mum doesn't have a right to that response.

00:12:04:11 - 00:12:41:05
Unknown
And, you know, that's what being a parent is. If Hannah was choosing to do a university degree that, among many thought wasn't a good idea, the mum would probably say, I think you should do something else, you know? And so it's it's really, it's really quite manipulative to, to not allow mothers and grandparents and each of us a voice to, to, to to show shock, horror or disapproval about an abortion, given that there are two human beings at stake, given that the child that Hannah was carrying had had the genetic composition of the of the family line of the Fergusons, her mother totally has a right to respond in the way that she

00:12:41:05 - 00:12:42:12
Unknown
wants to respond.

00:12:42:12 - 00:12:53:21
Unknown
And she makes it very clear that her mum was actually very supportive. And in fact, the only thing the mum did was get emotional and cry when told, by Hannah that she was going to kill her grandchild.

00:12:53:23 - 00:13:10:11
Unknown
I mean, what does Hannah expect her mum to be a robot? That when Hannah tells her this news that she's going for an abortion, the mum has to sit there expressionless, just so that Hannah can feel good about her choice? I mean, do we have to censor how we feel and how we think to that extent?

00:13:10:11 - 00:13:28:11
Unknown
Hannah also makes the point that she's a lawyer. She's the CEO of our own company. This was not the right child for her to have a baby. And again, this is the narrative that gets pushed at young women through. People like Hannah, who owns a media company time and time again, that if you have a baby, it will ruin your life.

00:13:28:11 - 00:13:45:03
Unknown
It will prevent your career. It will stop you from achieving your dreams. The thing is, I, as someone who's had a five babies, five babies in a decade, who had her first baby doing a PhD, who was told at the time when I was having my baby, you know, you're not going to finish your PhD, this isn't going to work for you.

00:13:45:03 - 00:13:53:14
Unknown
You're going to have to leave Oxford. You have to finish this up now. I got pregnant with my second child, and I was told, why other people. Are you going to have to quit your job? This isn't going away. The thing was,

00:13:53:14 - 00:14:02:11
Unknown
that's set so uncomfortably with me. Hannah calls herself a feminist as feminists, shouldn't we be saying that women inherently have reproductive potential?

00:14:02:15 - 00:14:07:15
Unknown
Let's create a world where women are able to flourish and have children at the same time,

00:14:07:15 - 00:14:28:00
Unknown
I've done it. But of countless women before me, I mean, Amy Coney Barrett, the Supreme Court judge in the US, has seven kids. Jacinda Ardern had a baby while in office. This is motherhood and children are not incompatible. But the narrative that Hannah Ferguson and the pro-abortion media wants women to believe is that we can't do it, and it's so disempowering.

00:14:28:08 - 00:14:46:18
Unknown
Yeah. So that other people's judgment of you made you feel a certain way. I think that when I found out I was pregnant, I was shocked because I was taking contraceptive, and that failed, obviously. And when I was making my decision, I literally discovered I was pregnant and booked an abortion within 30 minutes.

00:14:46:24 - 00:14:52:20
Unknown
So crime is questioned. Do you ever feel that other people's judgment of you made you feel shame?

00:14:53:00 - 00:15:18:01
Unknown
The way they, crafting this narrative is that women who have abortions are the victims. They are judged and they're shamed by this oppressive society, typically a patriarchal male society, what they'd like to present. But then they've got me as this young woman, articulating something quite different from the pro-life perspective. And I clearly can't call me a chauvinist or misogynist, but, you know, the narrative that they crafting is that women are the victim.

00:15:18:01 - 00:15:36:11
Unknown
And what was your shame, like, Hannah? I mean, what about the baby's perspective? They can't you can't ask the babies how they felt when their arms and legs were being broken apart, or their heart was being injected with poison in the place that they felt safest. But, you know, Hannah's been given prime time TV to talk about her shame.

00:15:36:11 - 00:15:58:10
Unknown
And she says, look, it wasn't that hard. I found out I was pregnant and I booked an abortion within 30 minutes. That's just mind blowing to me that the level of time and consideration given to kill her child was 30 minutes. Like. Like I might spend 30 minutes, cooking dinner tonight or thinking about, should I get my nails done because, you know, they growing out and it.

00:15:58:10 - 00:16:17:07
Unknown
Or maybe my eyebrows are getting to to bushy like, you know, it's kind of like that's the level of ambivalence and flippancy around this child that is in Hannah's womb, and this child who stems cells will remain in Hannah's body for the rest of Hannah's life, even though Hannah kills her child to have an abortion.

00:16:17:11 - 00:16:32:17
Unknown
I felt that I had to struggle with some sort of shame or moral question, because that's what women who had abortions had to do. I felt like that was an agenda that and I, I know it's pro-life, but I'm going to say anti-choice advocates, would impose onto me.

00:16:32:17 - 00:16:58:09
Unknown
And I actually am determined to not feel that because it was my choice to make. We've seen abortion back on the agenda in some Australian states. Why do you think that is? I think that the Trump style Republican MAGA politics in the US has resulted in a very slippery slope, where Australia is now mimicking the same conversations because there's an opportunity, and I think that we are nowhere near as divided or tribal in our politics as the United States.

00:16:58:09 - 00:17:07:03
Unknown
But I think that politicians in this country see an easy grab at division and deflection and distraction from actually making change for real people. On issues like the cost of living. And

00:17:07:12 - 00:17:28:24
Unknown
Hannah's comments are just so predictable that it's Trump. It's the extreme right wing, it's religious conservatives. It's men trying to control women's bodies. And she she uses the line and says, you know, they're doing this to distract from the issues that affect real people, you know, like the cost of living. She says. When slavery was legal in England, that that was how we saw slaves.

00:17:28:24 - 00:17:52:04
Unknown
So they weren't real people. And it's exactly that same language coming through now that these babies in utero are not, are not really alive. They're not really human being. They're not persons that we, that have human rights. And and so you're seeing that in Hannah Hannah's language. After she said this, creamy asked me a question and I responded, I, I, I and I don't.

00:17:52:04 - 00:18:11:11
Unknown
And this and this is, this is what's really frustrating is because she's making all of these claims. And then I respond and I say, well, actually in the Australian debate about abortion is not about Trump. It's got nothing to do with Trump. And it hasn't actually been initiated by politicians. It's been initiated by ordinary people and women like me who have worked with politicians.

00:18:11:11 - 00:18:37:04
Unknown
I've actively gone up to politicians like Rugby Carter, and and Ben Hood in South Australia, and Nick Brown and Kate Daoust in WA. I'm the one that's initiated those conversations and said, can we please start developing some legislation that gives human rights protections to these babies? And she's framing it as a Trump narrative. And in my response that I gave on air, I said, this is just, this is a misrepresentation of what's actually going on.

00:18:37:04 - 00:19:01:20
Unknown
Women don't want this. And the push to change Australian laws isn't coming from men trying to control women's bodies. It's from women saying they don't want this. And then and these laws have gone too far and they're too extreme. But, you know, I didn't want to report any of that. They just do put Hannah on a soapbox and allow her to, to make all of these claims that fit with the narrative that the mainstream media pushes.

00:19:02:01 - 00:19:30:06
Unknown
The majority of Australians do support abortion in some form. Today, all jurisdictions in Australia have decriminalized abortion, but there is no federal law. That means depending on where you live. Factors like access and cost vary significantly. For example, Tasmania allows for abortions up to 16 weeks into a pregnancy. Other states allow for longer gestation periods, while the act has no limit, so

00:19:30:16 - 00:19:49:06
Unknown
This information package is a complete fabrication. And when they showed it, I then said, you know, because I asked me a question about it and I said, before I answer your question, I'd like to point out the fact that what you just showed is why most Australians do not understand that abortion is legal up to birth for any reason.

00:19:49:08 - 00:20:05:13
Unknown
And I point out the fact I said it on on a in this pre-record that in each of these states there might be a gestational limit to get an abortion with one doctor approval. But after that gestational limit, abortion is legal with two doctors who approve.

00:20:05:13 - 00:20:24:11
Unknown
the New South Wales Abortion Law Reform Act, it says under section 61, a specialist medical practitioner may perform a termination on a person who is more than 22 weeks pregnant. So it's clearly available there and there's no limit on when it can happen. There's no there's no carve out, say, between 22 weeks and 28 weeks or 30 weeks.

00:20:24:16 - 00:20:28:18
Unknown
It's just after 22 weeks. And similarly, in the South Australian legislation,

00:20:28:18 - 00:20:35:21
Unknown
it says under section six, a medical practitioner may perform a termination on a person who is more than 22 weeks and six days pregnant.

00:20:35:23 - 00:21:12:09
Unknown
And there is criteria that has to be met. So in the New South Wales and South Australian legislation, it essentially says that if continuing the pregnancy would result in a significant risk of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant person, and that that's been mirrored across the country. And you can watch the first video of the Doctor Joe Show, where I tackle this, because the biggest lie about late term abortion is that it's not available up until birth, and it's only available in really restricted circumstances that are emergency and what I show is actually under every single state and territory law, you can get an abortion like term for mental health, which

00:21:12:09 - 00:21:22:14
Unknown
means that if there's any factor that's affecting your mental health, whether it's homelessness or relationship breakdown or just feeling like you can't cope, those are enough reason to to meet this.

00:21:22:14 - 00:21:27:20
Unknown
and it does happen. We have data about this. And I'm going to explain that data in a moment in response to something else that Hannah says.

00:21:27:22 - 00:21:29:18
Unknown
But the other point I'd like to make is

00:21:29:18 - 00:21:55:13
Unknown
In black and white SBS is saying abortion is only legal in Tasmania up until 16 weeks, and in other states up to viability. This is a complete lie. It is legal after those points, with the approval of two doctors, to say that it's not legal because you need a second doctor to approve, you might as well say, well, it's not legal up until 16 weeks in Tasmania because you need one doctor to approve, or you might as well say it's illegal to drive a car in Australia because you need to go through a process of getting a driver's license.

00:21:55:13 - 00:22:03:02
Unknown
So it's illegal to bear firearms in Australia because you need to get a license and, meet some test before you can hold a gun.

00:22:03:02 - 00:22:07:05
Unknown
Or it's illegal to buy alcohol because you need to show your ID before you get a six pack.

00:22:07:07 - 00:22:16:10
Unknown
These are complete lies being perpetuated not just by SBS, but through the mainstream media. And every time that they raise the issue of late term abortion,

00:22:16:19 - 00:22:29:16
Unknown
The majority of Australians have supported the legislation of abortion in some form since the 1980s. Studies show support for abortion today is between 70 and 80%.

00:22:30:02 - 00:22:50:16
Unknown
again in the show itself, I make the point that that is misleading. There's an annual Ipsos poll. So Ipsos is a well known, polling company, very reputable. They annually, interview a thousand Australians on their perspectives on abortion. It's part of a world wide study that they do now. In that study, it shows that 74% of Australians identifies pro-choice.

00:22:50:21 - 00:23:11:17
Unknown
But that's at six weeks. And actually in that study, it asks the question, how do you feel about abortion? Up to 20 weeks. And in that study, only 31% of Australians say that they're comfortable with abortion up to 20 weeks. So for them to say majority of Australians are pro-choice and support abortion, that's just incorrect. And I make that point.

00:23:11:17 - 00:23:28:22
Unknown
I say it in the pre-record, but it's totally cut from the bit that's aired. And so once again, the show is perpetuating blatant lies about community attitudes around abortion because it suits their narrative that that this is something that the that the community supports and

00:23:28:22 - 00:23:35:01
Unknown
and that it's only fringe dwelling extremist Christians, religious nutjobs like myself and and you guys who are against it.

00:23:35:08 - 00:23:55:01
Unknown
Hannah, how do you feel about legislation like what Joanna is proposing, which restricts only late term abortion? So my abortion happened at six weeks, so I haven't had the experience of a late term abortion. But my concern with that legislation is that it's people who are legal scholars who are making that decision for a person instead of them and their medical practitioner.

00:23:55:08 - 00:24:04:07
Unknown
So this is something I get time and time again. I'm constantly trolled for the fact that I'm not a medical doctor, but the thing that I'm talking about is the law.

00:24:04:07 - 00:24:19:19
Unknown
I'm the thing. The main thing that I talk about, on social media and in my advocacy and in drafting bills is the law. And why should this medical procedure that kills a human being that involves two parties, two patients?

00:24:19:19 - 00:24:25:00
Unknown
why should it be limited to between a medical doctor and and a woman between an abortionist and a woman?

00:24:25:00 - 00:24:47:02
Unknown
Why should it? Why are they the only two people that get a say on this? There are plenty of circumstance in our society where we say, actually, a third party should be involved. For example, in domestic violence, we don't just leave it up to a married couple to decide how things should happen in the home when there's child abuse going on, we don't say, well, oh, that's just between the abuser and the victim.

00:24:47:04 - 00:25:07:08
Unknown
When people are on the road, we have heaps of laws around how to drive safely and and seatbelt wearing and stopping at lights and police cars, monitoring the way that we drive that, that the nature of our society and the way that we have laws is to protect the vulnerable and weak. And in the case of abortion, you have a weak party who doesn't have a voice.

00:25:07:11 - 00:25:14:23
Unknown
Why should it be between the abortionist who wants to kill this baby, or who has the power to, and the mother who also wants to kill this baby?

00:25:14:23 - 00:25:22:11
Unknown
if it's just between a woman and her doctor, why kind of mother march her ten year old child into the doctor's surgery and say, I need you to kill my child.

00:25:22:11 - 00:25:30:10
Unknown
I'm under significant distress. I mean, if it's just between a woman and a doctor and a parent has full rights over their child.

00:25:30:16 - 00:25:58:00
Unknown
Late term abortion. Part of my concern is that so much of the political and legal focus on it, and the drive for it to be in the center of the media, distorts the reality of how many people actually have late term abortions, which account for less than 1% in this country, I believe, and in South Australia. So when we drive the narrative of late term abortion right into the mainstream media, I think we're distorting the reality of how many people actually experience it and why they make those decisions.

00:25:58:00 - 00:26:21:06
Unknown
Because I think when we frame it as a decision, instead of a healthcare choice made under duress in often extreme circumstances to do with the fetal health or the pregnant person's health, I think that we instead confuse the population who say the language of 20 weeks, 27 weeks and think that a person's just willy nilly accidentally fallen into this and made an error of judgment, when in fact it's often an emergency healthcare decision.

00:26:21:06 - 00:26:28:16
Unknown
And I'm I'm really frustrated by the distortion of the reality of how these decisions are made, and that they're often under duress and in extreme circumstances.

00:26:28:23 - 00:26:59:19
Unknown
this is the bit when I realized this is a stitch up by the SBS, because I clearly said on air that late term abortion is never needed in an emergency situation. So Hannah is making the point that, you know, we need late term abortions because women might get into emergency situations. I make the point that after 23 weeks and up until birth, there is no situation where it is safe, better or necessary for the mother's health to inject the baby with poison and to kill them in utero and deliver them dead.

00:26:59:21 - 00:27:23:19
Unknown
I make the point that in any kind of medical emergency that a woman is facing late in pregnancy, like severe pre-eclampsia, maybe she develops cancer. Maybe she's got ruptured membranes and she could go sepsis. Whatever the situation is late in pregnancy, the intervention that a doctor will make in an emergency is to separate the mother and baby by getting the baby out quickly through an emergency C-section.

00:27:23:21 - 00:27:31:05
Unknown
I mean, that's the whole reason we have emergency C-sections is because you can get a baby out within an hour because it's an emergency intervention.

00:27:31:05 - 00:27:35:13
Unknown
in contrast to late term abortion takes hours and days, so you don't do it.

00:27:35:13 - 00:27:38:21
Unknown
If a mother is in a true medical emergency and I make this point on air

00:27:38:21 - 00:28:00:23
Unknown
and they don't show it. And the second point I make in response to this is when they say that late term abortions account for less than 1% of abortions, and what they're really trying to do there is trivialize the amount of babies who are being killed at this late stage, because they know that most Australians would feel really uncomfortable with the idea of a baby being killed at that late stage, because most Australians have have a premature baby in their life.

00:28:00:23 - 00:28:20:09
Unknown
They know someone where the first hand or someone in their circle who's who had a baby born at 26 weeks of 28 weeks or 32 weeks. And so the reason the media and Hannah here is trying to make it sound like, oh, it's less than 1%. It's really marginal and insignificant, is because they know that people wouldn't like it if they really knew the facts when in reality.

00:28:20:09 - 00:28:40:16
Unknown
And I said this on air and they just didn't show it. Between 2010 and 2020, close to 5000 babies have been killed late term in just two Australian states. In Queensland. In Victoria, 4929 babies had their heart injected with potassium and then were delivered dead. And, you know, I make this point on it, but they don't show it.

00:28:40:16 - 00:29:11:18
Unknown
And I, I make the point that actually the reason the pro-abortion brigade and the media and, and Hannah get away with calling it, a rare occurrence is because the number of abortions, the sheer number of abortions in Australia are close to 100,000. This study suggests it's about 88,000 babies that are killed. And so 1%, doesn't sound like a much, but when you think of 1% of close to 100,000, that's nearly a thousand babies a year who are being killed through a late term abortion.

00:29:11:20 - 00:29:24:09
Unknown
So, you know, the the manipulation of the data and the facts and the distortion is on full display here. I actually expose it and they don't show it. They censor those clips.

00:29:24:09 - 00:29:47:08
Unknown
Do you believe there should be a cutoff date for having an abortion? I believe that's my decision to make in my own circumstances, in circumstances that affect others. I do not believe it is the a lawyer. I do not believe it is the government's decision to make. I understand why those regulations, and I agree with regulations that require the assessment from multiple medical professionals, but I think that it's their choice to make in regards to the patient.

00:29:47:12 - 00:29:55:04
Unknown
And I make the point that it's actually just two abortionist, two abortionist who are, signing off on this.

00:29:55:04 - 00:30:18:21
Unknown
So when Hannah and the the media tries to make this sound like it's a rigorous process that the woman has to go through now, it's actually easier than getting a driver's license. There is no kind of waiting period. There's no, there's no process. By looking through the gestational development of the child and, and the health or any of that, it is as simple as walking up to a place like an abortion clinic.

00:30:18:24 - 00:30:45:00
Unknown
For example, in South Australia, you go to the pregnancy advisory clinic. They've got two abortionists on site who will sign off on your late term abortion. Yes, you meet with them and you go through an interview, but it's not very long and they sign it off. And so, you know, yeah, I get asked on air about this, about my response to this, and I make the point that there's plenty of areas where the government regulates just the examples that I gave just previously about domestic violence or road safety.

00:30:45:04 - 00:30:52:24
Unknown
And again, they don't show any of that as a response in Hannah's, Hannah's lies and distortions are allowed to be presented as fact.

00:30:52:24 - 00:31:00:07
Unknown
So after weaponising Hannah's story, they then move on to a GP who is an abortionist and they ask her about this.

00:31:00:12 - 00:31:01:17
Unknown
Let's take a look.

00:31:01:17 - 00:31:27:21
Unknown
GP and you're the state chair of the Royal Australian College of General Practitioners. Medically. When does life begin? It's a great question and a really interesting one, and it is a complex question and it has different answers depending on who you speak to. So yes, at fertilization, the process of becoming a child starts at about six six and a half weeks.

00:31:27:21 - 00:31:49:21
Unknown
There will be a heartbeat, but for the child to be born, it has to be able to sustain its life outside of the mum's womb. And in most states around Australia that seem to be at around 24 weeks. And that's when the survival of that baby's going to be more likely. So 50% will survive after 24 weeks. Outside of mum.

00:31:50:02 - 00:31:59:13
Unknown
once again on the show, I make the point which they don't actually air, but I make the point that, 96% of scientists agree that life begins.

00:31:59:13 - 00:32:25:01
Unknown
Human life begins at fertilization. She is trying to craft this definition that life exists when it can sustain itself. So she identifies viability is the point when a baby can survive outside the womb. Never mind the fact that abortion is legal up until birth. But you wouldn't know. Watching this show, watching SBS inside, or listening to her words, because they try to make it sound like, oh, after that cut off, you can't get one.

00:32:25:03 - 00:32:47:05
Unknown
But she's using a definition that it's only when life can sustain itself that we suddenly have life, that that's not a definition, that scientists use. You have human life from the moment of conception. And if we use that definition, well, a newborn baby can't sustain herself. She's entirely dependent. If the condition for, human rights is that you can't be dependent.

00:32:47:06 - 00:32:57:04
Unknown
And the elderly, a child, none of these would be human lives worthy of human rights under this world view. It just doesn't make sense. And I make that point, but they don't show it

00:32:57:04 - 00:33:14:20
Unknown
Any situations where the rights of the fetus do trump those of the mother? No. Why do you think that is? The mother's rights will come first because.

00:33:14:22 - 00:33:18:12
Unknown
To hear that present, that human, their life.

00:33:18:12 - 00:33:36:23
Unknown
It's just a really pathetic response that here at present they're human. So, you know, it's like, well, is how is this woman even a doctor? The baby in utero. What does she think it it's a dog or like a dolphin. I mean, the baby in utero is a human. It's like human parents.

00:33:37:00 - 00:34:02:09
Unknown
And what she's essentially saying is, I'm just going to deal with the person in front of me who's telling the tragic story, but not turn my mind to the other human party, the other human being that's affected through this process. When I, as an abortionist, carry out an abortion, I make these points on and I also make the points in response to this because creamy throws to me and I make the point that there are plenty of other areas where we recognize that the fetus has rights.

00:34:02:09 - 00:34:33:18
Unknown
And so I talk about international law, where under the ICC it is illegal to give the death penalty to a pregnant woman. I also speak about how in child protection, once a baby's 20 weeks in utero, you can report to child protection authorities if you think that child in utero is at risk. I also talk about when, an operation is done so fetal surgery is done, that the doctors have two patients at that point, and pain relief is given to that fetus because they can see that the outcomes for the fetus are better in that surgery.

00:34:33:22 - 00:34:51:24
Unknown
I also make the point, around drink driving and that in many places around Australia, like New South Wales and Queensland, we have laws that recognize if a drunk driver kills a pregnant woman, he's liable. She's liable for two counts of murder because two human beings have died. All of those points I make are not aired on the show.

00:34:51:24 - 00:35:01:14
Unknown
It's also worth pointing out that she gets paid by the stronger party in that scenario as an abortionist, her paycheck comes from the mother that wants to kill her baby.

00:35:01:14 - 00:35:04:23
Unknown
The victim in this, they don't pay. They have no rights.

00:35:04:23 - 00:35:27:03
Unknown
Hannah, what do you think about that? The mothers rights versus the fetuses. Babies rights? Well, I think that's something to consider. Is that if I were to have a baby today and that baby was to instead of being a parasite that was feeding on me to be a living, breathing, autonomous, but still would be largely incapable but human in the world.

00:35:27:11 - 00:35:47:18
Unknown
it's really creepy how when Hannah dehumanizes her baby and calls her a parasite, the abortionist smirks. I just just want to point that out. So distasteful. It's like they're part of some secret club where, you know, we just mock these little babies in utero with total disregard for them. And it's just it's it's really disgusting.

00:35:47:18 - 00:35:52:15
Unknown
Human in the world, which is when I consider him to be a human being. Until that point, I don't

00:35:52:20 - 00:35:59:02
Unknown
Once again from Hannah, we see this painstaking effort to craft a narrative that makes her feel okay about her choice.

00:35:59:02 - 00:36:22:19
Unknown
So, you know, she says they're not a human. They were human when I consider them to be. And and again, on the show, I make the point that why does the stronger party get to determine the the rights or the humanity of the weaker party? You know that any genocide in human history has involved the powerful party trampling over the weaker party by saying they don't have human rights, they're less human.

00:36:22:21 - 00:36:42:13
Unknown
And that's exactly what Hannah's doing here. And she talks earlier in the show about this shame imposition, when in reality, the way that she has crafted this narrative in the pro-abortion side of crafted, that is, this is women determining when human rights exist. And if any of us dare say anything because it just makes absolutely no sense.

00:36:42:13 - 00:36:59:05
Unknown
And it's not intellectually or philosophically rigorous, somehow, by daring to question, we're the ones imposing shame when, as I said before, she's had nothing but idealization for what she did in killing her baby. It's almost like a badge of honor for the radical left. Now to say, I had an abortion, how good am I?

00:36:59:05 - 00:37:25:11
Unknown
when they are. If they needed an organ donation or a blood transfusion. There are no circumstances under the law which I would be compelled to give that to them, even as their mother. And I think it's interesting that the laws instead focus on when they are a fetus, an embryo, a clump of cells, that there is a demand or a consideration that I would be a murderer for, not for for making a choice about my own body.

00:37:25:13 - 00:37:32:03
Unknown
And yet, if they are a living human being outside of my body, the law couldn't compel me to do anything. As said mother.

00:37:32:12 - 00:37:40:13
Unknown
I was really struck by the selfishness of this and still remain in shock that this would be the worldview of these people.

00:37:40:15 - 00:37:58:08
Unknown
What kind of a mother would have that response if her child was sick and needed an organ? I mean, my daughter was actually watching this when it aired last night with me, and she just said to me, mom, you you wouldn't do that, would you? You wouldn't just, discard me if if I needed help. And I said, of course not.

00:37:58:08 - 00:38:24:24
Unknown
Of course not. I love you, and and I just want to call that out. That, that that's just such a sick worldview. It's so selfish. But the other thing is, it also it just this set up that she's got that once a person is born, a mother isn't compelled under the law to save their dependent party's life by giving an organ because she's got full bodily autonomy.

00:38:25:01 - 00:39:01:17
Unknown
It's just a it's a it's a false narrative. It's, it's it's something that doesn't actually work if we think about it. Because what the law, what I want the law to do is to prevent us from intentionally killing a human being. So in an abortion, because the the goal of the abortion or the reason for it is for the abortionist to kill the baby, that needs to be illegal, intentional killing, just because there isn't a law that compels a mother to save the life of her child once born, by donating a part of her body to that child through an organ transplant, that doesn't mean that we shouldn't have laws that prevent intentional killing.

00:39:01:17 - 00:39:15:11
Unknown
In fact, we do have laws like. And this is what I said on the show. I said if I mother. But I didn't hear this speech. So I'm just having to tell you guys that that a mother doesn't isn't able to intentionally kill her child once the child is born,

00:39:15:11 - 00:39:39:22
Unknown
the mother doesn't have to give the baby her organ. But the mother is absolutely 100% prevented by the law from going up to a doctor and ordering a hit job on her own child. So Hannah's argument here doesn't even make sense. And I again, I say donated, but they don't show it. And, you know, I think it's important, though, to you guys listening to, to to sort of know how to unpack some of these false narratives that are portrayed by the other side.

00:39:40:00 - 00:40:02:21
Unknown
The show goes on and it moves on to other topics vaccinations, circumcision. But the issue of government assisted suicide comes up. Not that they call it that. They call it voluntary assisted dying. And they again weaponize the story of a woman who is the lead advocate for government assisted suicide. And she uses the story of someone close to her who suffered for a long time.

00:40:03:01 - 00:40:21:05
Unknown
And and no one here is diminishing the suffering that that people face in life. And that, can can be very, very difficult in the context of this. They ask Matt Cliff, the director of Cherish Life, to give his perspective. But look at the way he asks the question.

00:40:21:13 - 00:40:45:19
Unknown
Matthew, you head up a religious advocacy group. You believe life begins at conception. What about the end of life? Should we be allowed to choose when we die? We believe life is a conception to be cherished, and we also believe that to the end of life as well. We feel that it's vitally important that life should be cared for up until the to the end.

00:40:46:02 - 00:41:06:21
Unknown
She says as a religious organization, and when this happens in the pre-record, Matt Cliff corrects her and says, just to begin with, Kimmy, I want to make the point that Church life is a non-religious organization where human rights organizations were concerned with the human rights from the moment of conception until natural death.

00:41:06:23 - 00:41:24:14
Unknown
And he he corrects her. And then later in the show and they speak, doesn't. And she asks the question again, a different question. But she says, you know, as the director of a religious organization. And again, he corrects there and says as, that just just to be clear, Cherish Life is a human rights organization. It's not a religious organization.

00:41:24:16 - 00:41:42:11
Unknown
And yet the bit that I hear from him, they only show one quote from him, which I think is appalling because he said more on the not, but they clearly have the narrative that they want to portray. And you know, he said many good things, but they only show this one quote and they cut out the bit where he clarifies that that question is incorrect.

00:41:42:17 - 00:42:02:23
Unknown
And again, that for me was a real, a moment inwardly when I was watching it last night where I just thought, it this is just that they're, they're pushing an agenda. The fact that they all of the things where I talk about the data and the evidence and the law, they just cut all of that out and they don't show that.

00:42:02:23 - 00:42:26:14
Unknown
But now here's Matt and he's he's correcting just this very basic point that they're not a religious organization. And that's just cut out. And they keep in the question that I know is wrong, because he's brought it to their attention in multiple times in the pre-record. And that to me was, I guess they it was just a moment of satisfaction, perhaps reassurance to know that I'm not just seeing things.

00:42:26:14 - 00:42:35:16
Unknown
This really is, a show that pretend to show both sides, but in reality they have an agenda and and they're showing their agenda.

00:42:35:16 - 00:42:59:10
Unknown
all of this to say, I, I do feel really disappointed with this show. I think you guys have been listening to me for a while. Know that I always go into these things as a bit of an optimist. And, you know, with the live birth spiel, when we introduced the NSA last year, I just thought that would pass because you'd have to be a genocidal maniac to vote against a bill that merely prevents babies in the third trimester from being injected with poison and delivered dead.

00:42:59:16 - 00:43:20:05
Unknown
And yet we lost by one vote, because they clearly are these psychopaths in the Parliament who just love killing babies that much. But, you know, I was optimistic that we would be able to have a good, coherent debate about it on insight. Because of the conversations I've had with the producers, I guess I was optimistic that we would be able to, show both sides fairly.

00:43:20:05 - 00:43:41:02
Unknown
And that's not what happened. And it is disappointing, but the silver lining, I hope the takeaway from this is, is just that hopefully it sparks a conversation for one person or two people, and hopefully for you guys, when you listen to this video, it's given you language. And data and facts so that you can start having these conversations.

00:43:41:06 - 00:44:01:20
Unknown
Because as you guys know, I used to be pro-choice, and it takes each of us having the courage to have the conversation, having the courage to show up even when we know it's going to be a stitch up and everything's stacked against us when we do that. Lives are saved, minds are changed, and we shift the culture. Thank you for watching and I look forward to seeing you next time